Maria, 53, Manchester
Occupation Recruitment director
Voting record Conservative when they were more mainstream, but never again after austerity. Now Lib Dem
Amuse bouche When Maria was 13 and growing up in Ireland, she inherited £50 and bought a sheep. Her brother got £100. “He bought a cow, so I was really envious”
Paul, 63, Manchester
Occupation CCTV operator
Voting record Reform, before that the Brexit party and Ukip. Describes himself as “king of the gammons, the sort of person a Guardian reader would run a mile from”. Although …
Amuse bouche Paul does read the Guardian, is vegetarian, and has been to Pakistan, Ethiopia and North Korea. “People think that because I’m on the right, I must do two weeks in Benidorm”
For starters
Maria I had an alcohol-free beer, anchovies as a starter, then a tomato and tuna salad. Paul is a conundrum – a vegetarian Guardian reader, and a Millwall fan. He loves travelling, but seemed to have a huge mistrust of foreigners and is quite rightwing. He probably thought I was a conundrum.
Paul I was nervous and thought: “What have I let myself in for?” I was a bit terrified you’d send me a Portuguese or Brazilian immigrant who wouldn’t understand my humour, but Maria is Irish so we had a bit of craic.
The big beef
Maria The 7 October was horrific. In no way do I support Hamas. Israel had the right to defend itself, but what they have done is way over the top. I’m very against Netanyahu. He’s not thinking about the hostages, or the Israeli people, he’s just desperate for votes from the right of his party. He is obliterating Gaza: 42,000 killed and 80% of buildings destroyed.
Paul I’m not Jewish, I’m not Christian; Israel is just a country I really like. I’ve been there, have friends there, I agree with the Zionist narrative and support what’s going on there. Maria is Irish, so she has an automatic kind of sympathy for the underdog. I look at Israel and see people who have been treated badly returning to their homelands.
Maria Ireland was one of the first European countries to endorse the establishment of a Palestinian state. They were banished from their lands; my ancestors were banished from ours; Britain colonised both countries. My hope is for a two-state solution.
Paul That ship has sailed. They’ve had a chance for a two-state solution since 1937, when it was first proposed. It’s just going to carry on until unfortunately something big happens. If politicians have been unable to solve this, I don’t know how two people having a meal in Manchester are going to do it.
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Sharing plate
Maria The only thing we agreed on was our mutual dislike of Boris Johnson. It’s all about him, and he goes with the wind, like with Brexit. It depends on the career opportunities for him, and then he obviously lied through his teeth.
Paul Boris is an opportunist charlatan.
For afters
Maria If you look at the stats, natural disasters have increased five-fold in just 50 years – look at the floods, wildfires in Greece, etc. He said that’s all arsonists; he just didn’t seem that bothered.
Paul In the 70s, we were told there would be an ice age, then it was acid rain, then a hole in the ozone layer in the 90s. There’s just so much scare-mongering that it breeds in people of my age and class a lot of cynicism and the feeling that it’s just a kind of scam. Politicians were never interested in green issues until they realised they could tax people; then they suddenly became very enthusiastic.
Maria I asked: “Are you not worried about your children?” He said: “I don’t have children.” I don’t have children either, but I worry about my nieces and nephews, and for future generations.
Paul I think the climate is changing, but that human input is not as extensive as made out. If we adopted every single principle of net zero and everyone in Britain gave up their cars, it wouldn’t make any difference except to make ourselves a lot poorer.
Takeaways
Maria It was really beneficial to meet somebody so opposite to me and try to understand where they came from. He was very respectful, and we had a bit of a laugh. But it hasn’t changed any of my beliefs – we’re worlds apart.
Paul You have to get out of your comfort zone in terms of your narratives and mantras, and try to see it in neutral terms. She’s a nice lady, and there was no animosity. At the end it was a case of: nice to meet you, have a nice life.
Additional reporting: Kitty Drake
